Evensong LARP

In Game => Lore => Topic started by: Thaddeus Bottom on December 06, 2016, 09:01:14 pm

Title: Ritual Words
Post by: Thaddeus Bottom on December 06, 2016, 09:01:14 pm
Please post ritual language words & pronunciation guidance here! 

Let's also try to tag posting with how certain you are of its meaning and spelling: we can try a simple Low, Medium, or High rating on each.


Words

Word Meaning Confidence
ASHEN Dream / Good Dream PURE CONJECTURE
BEN DANSUBA Home Medium
DAMPOGU Community Medium
DHATOSU Moth High
DHIGE'A Volcano Medium
DOTHU A favored of Dothu / someone with a Vow High
GADEZIL Horse High
GESAMA Black High
GOMMASO Yellow High
KAZHAGEN Moon High
MATHUNDHU Purple High
MOSHOZA Create Medium
MOSHO New / Newness? PURE CONJECTURE
NASHOTO air High
NEZHIMEL White High
PABOSHA Fire Medium
PENTHEMEGA a Weavewalker High
PETHIL Green High
POPOTHO Stars High
PUNSAMA Blue High
SANDANGIZA Sacrifice Medium
SENA Invoke Medium
SHEDHOMA Adversaries Medium
SHEPAKEL Shield Medium
SIGEZA Wolf High
SOPUMOSHO someone new to the area High
TASENGAN Earth High
TOSHON Owl High
ZOKUNA Exile Medium
ZHADO Stone Medium
ZHOTHA Snake High





Pronunciation Guide
- "dh" is pronounced as "th"
- "zh" is a sound like the S in "treasure", not a hard Z as in "zipper"
Title: Re: Ritual Words
Post by: Thaddeus Bottom on December 06, 2016, 09:04:33 pm
Started this off with my Pathfolding words, plus the ones I collected from the ritual we did to open the treasury shrine.
Title: Re: Ritual Words
Post by: Miri Thorel on December 06, 2016, 09:07:32 pm
TASENGAN is earth.
PETHIL is green.
GADEZIL is horse.

Those are my Pathfolding words, so I'd mark them High.

--Miri
Title: Re: Ritual Words
Post by: Cyril Vauzelle on December 06, 2016, 09:12:41 pm
Mine are:

Popotho - Stars
Mathundhu - Purplr
Dhatosu - Moth

We did learn on Saturday, before the ritual on the stained glass pane that dh is pronounced as th.

Shoshon also began collecting a longer list of words from people, I will see if they can transcribe their list here.
Title: Re: Ritual Words
Post by: Branka on December 06, 2016, 09:48:03 pm
Gesama can simply mean black - high
Nashoto - air - high

my other is already there.
Title: Re: Ritual Words
Post by: Thaddeus Bottom on December 06, 2016, 10:33:35 pm
Thank you, Branka.  Darkness was a mistranslation on my part.  Fixed.
Title: Re: Ritual Words
Post by: Hazel on December 06, 2016, 11:14:07 pm
NEZHIMEL - white - High
SIGEZA - wolf - High

You've already got my third ritual word.
Title: Re: Ritual Words
Post by: Misia on December 07, 2016, 08:23:08 am
Gommaso: yellow
Zhotha: snake (based on the pronounciation of various people in my Weavewalks, the Zh is a sound like the S in "treasure", not a hard Z as in "zipper")
Title: Re: Ritual Words
Post by: Viola Benestera on December 07, 2016, 11:39:51 am
From the ritual we did to protect the tavern, using the Troyvich Panel.

DAMPOGU- Community
SANDANGIZA- Sacrifice
SENA- Invoke
DHIGE'A- Volcano
PABOSHA- Fire
ZHADO- Stone
MOSHOZA- Create
SHEPAKEL- Shield
ZOKUNA- Exile
SHEDHOMA- Adversaries
BEN DANSUBA- Home

As for what I would rate these for accuracy?  I'd say medium.  While we know the ritual worked as hoped, that does not rule out alternate meanings that happened to align correctly with the intention of the story and ritual.
Title: Re: Ritual Words
Post by: Lucient on December 07, 2016, 12:33:13 pm
Does anyone know the word for Dream or Light?
Title: Re: Ritual Words
Post by: Thaddeus Bottom on December 07, 2016, 12:46:30 pm
Gommaso: yellow
Zhotha: snake (based on the pronounciation of various people in my Weavewalks, the Zh is a sound like the S in "treasure", not a hard Z as in "zipper")

Misia, how would you rate your confidence in the accuracy of Gommaso?  If it's from a pathfolding or weavewalking ritual you use, it'd be high.

EDIT: Same question on Zhotha.  Thanks!
Title: Re: Ritual Words
Post by: Tasi on December 07, 2016, 01:21:39 pm
PUNSAMA  Blue  High
Title: Re: Ritual Words
Post by: Misia on December 07, 2016, 02:44:08 pm
As these are my ritual words, the accuracy of the spelling is high. The pronunciation of Zhotha that I heard in the Weave presumably is correct, as it came from the lips of Her followers.
Title: Re: Ritual Words
Post by: Misia on December 07, 2016, 02:46:08 pm
And you have misspelled Zhotha (snake)
Title: Re: Ritual Words
Post by: Thaddeus Bottom on December 07, 2016, 02:51:08 pm
Oops, thanks.
Title: Re: Ritual Words
Post by: Miri Thorel on December 07, 2016, 02:53:13 pm
Does anyone know the word for Dream or Light?

I don't, but I have a guess that ASHEN must mean something related to dream. It shows up in the Sheashenata chants. And if SENA means "invoke" like we have it here, then "Ashensena" would be something about invoking Ashen, and the Ashensena invokes the Dreaming Goddess to protect our sleep.

So it's a guess, I wouldn't even put it at "low" on confidence, but it feels like there might be something there.

--Miri
Title: Re: Ritual Words
Post by: Miri Thorel on December 07, 2016, 03:27:37 pm
I am speculating, but I might guess that the element "MOSHO" has something to do with newness. It's in MOSHOZA, "create," and SOPUMOSHO, "someone new to the area."

--Miri
Title: Re: Ritual Words
Post by: Ilyani on December 07, 2016, 05:18:05 pm
All of my ritual words for Pathfolding are already accounted for.

According to a conversation with Shoshone, he says the apostrophe in "DHIGE'A" should be pronounced with an "f" sound, making the proper pronunciation of that word "Thigefa" when one considers the "Dh" at the beginning.

Again, I know not where he came across the "f", but he seemed confident.
Title: Re: Ritual Words
Post by: Brenn Odacer on December 09, 2016, 02:17:57 pm
GUNKAZO - Fox - high
Title: Re: Ritual Words
Post by: Lucient on December 13, 2016, 07:34:57 pm
As a word of caution if the words for Nightmares or Malefear or Harrowed come up and you learn them, please do not report them in public. Find a member of the Inquisition, notably a FULL Inquisitor, such as Perevel and give her that information. Having those words spread around will lead to no good coming about.

I thank you all,

Praise to be Izail
Title: Re: Ritual Words
Post by: Shoshann on December 21, 2016, 08:27:24 pm
Greetings,

I do apologize for not having replied sooner.  I have dedicated much time to the stained glass and got distracted by its resplendence.  Now that I have an evening to spare, I would gladly share the words I compiled over the last gathering.  Many of them are already listed here, but I am confident in them all in that they are as accurate as possible.

I hope they help,
Shoshann

-- Concepts --
BEN DANSUBA - Home
DAMPOGU - Community
MOSHOZA - Create
SANDENGIZA - Sacrifice
SENA - Invoke
SHEDHOMA - Adversaries
SHEPAKEL - Shield
ZOKUNA - Exile

-- Locations/Elements --
NASHOTO - Air
PABOSHA - Fire
ZHADO - Stone
TASENGAN - Earth

DHIGE'A - Volcano
KAZHAGEN - Moon
POPOTHO - Stars

-- Animals --
DHATOSU - Moth
GADEZIL - Horse
NAZHINZHAN - Phoenix
PENEZIL - Squirrel
SEPEZEL - Rabbit
SIGEZA - Wolf
TOSHON - Owl

-- Colors --
GESAMA - Black
MATHUNDHU - Purple
NEZHIMEL - White
PETHIL - Green
PUNSAMA - Blue
NAKEZIL - Orange
Title: Re: Ritual Words
Post by: Hazel on March 18, 2017, 10:58:49 pm
New Words!

Got these from a letter I received.
Common consensus was that they were counting words.

MA - one (also a/an or the, speculation (rated low) is that MA-[word] might denote a Proper Noun, ie MADAMPOGU -> The Community)
DO - two
KA - three
NEN - four
SHAN - five
SHIL - six
ZHU - seven
THEL - eight
KEL - nine (KEL also appears elsewhere, but it's unclear if those instances have the same meaning)
MASHO - ten (possibly literally "one many")
MASHOMA - ten and one (11)
MASHODO - ten and two (12)
MASHOKA - ten and three (13)
Title: Re: Ritual Words
Post by: Chel Verdansk on March 19, 2017, 06:12:06 am
My friends!

I have two new words for vocabulary!

Dhenkidha:  Sun (High, from Weave Walking ritual)
Toshonzhotha: Literally "Owl snake" (toshon-zhotha), in story by Old Wandering Zoku Storyteller, is a powerful and scary entity that a Queen summoned to test suitors for her heir, and which "flew back to the moon, from whence it came" when its task completed.
Title: Re: Ritual Words
Post by: Miri Thorel on March 19, 2017, 07:57:36 am

I think we actually had it confirmed that MA- at the beginning of a word means "a." We speculate that you can do the same thing with other numbers, so Zhudampogu would be "seven communities" or perhaps "a community of seven" We were also told that -ANA at the end of a word turns a noun into a verb.

More words. Most of these came from the memory game, with pictures, so I would rate most of them high, with the exception of BAGABA'UNU and KALA, where the meaning of the picture was a little ambiguous.

BAGABIL - water
BAGABA'UNU - ocean or wave
DANTO - mask
DHENKIDHA - sun
DUNON - dagger
'IZEN - light
KALA - skull or death (was on a card in the memory game with a skull)
KO'ENA - lightning
MADHIL - music
MINSIN - tree
NIZHEL - flower
TISHESHINA - broken
Title: Re: Ritual Words
Post by: Miri Thorel on March 19, 2017, 08:06:33 am
Oh, and also, the first word of the chants we all grew up knowing should be written SHE'ASHEN'ATA, and pronounced "shay-fa-shen-fa-ta" or "she-va-shen-va-ta" - we've been told F, but the echostone prayer sounded more like V to at least some of us.

This also showed up on one of the tablets.
Title: Re: Ritual Words
Post by: Chel Verdansk on March 19, 2017, 06:57:43 pm
Is interesting.  Studying dese words, you see how dey have filtered into modern language, in names.  Such as:

Zoku, de people wit no home and "zokuna"= exile

I suspect dat Thilmil once called "Pethilmilsin"="Green Tree"

Also, god of forests is Milsin, word for "tree."

Who wear masks?  Dantessians!  And "danto"= mask.

So here some speculations:  (I know oders have some of dese before me)

kanon = knowledge (from God)

izail = justice (from God)

tamal = someting to do with grain or harvests (from God)

More tings to tinks about:

Kotodun live in Silver Dagger Mountains.  Does dat word have to do wit mountains or daggers or silver, or any combination?

Zhekiza is on coast.  Is dat what dat word means, or someting else, which we have lost? 

Mostly speculation, but tings to ponder and remember when we find more words.
Title: Re: Ritual Words
Post by: Chel Verdansk on March 19, 2017, 08:46:50 pm
Question.  Do we know if Ancient Language uses diphtongs?  err, diphthongs?  You know, two vowels spelled but combined into one sound?
Title: Re: Ritual Words
Post by: Miri Thorel on March 20, 2017, 09:07:05 am
I am keeping a running journal of the words we are learning, with some notes. It's pretty much what's been shared here, just all put in one place. It's designed to fit into my journal.

Not so pretty version that can be written in (https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B3boCOd5DJ14d1c4dllGUEdlVU0)

Prettier version that can't be written in (I'll make new versions of this as I add to the other one) (https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B3boCOd5DJ14MHY1ZWRjMWlGSkE)

Title: Re: Ritual Words
Post by: Shoshann on March 20, 2017, 10:39:58 am
Greetings,

I have compiled the writings that we acquired in this cave, as well as the ones from previous parts of the expedition.  What we have here already is fairly comprehensive.  I've taken to task the translation of the various scripts we have, and will share them as time permits.   

Please be mindful to separate speculation versus known information.  I'd hate for us to be misdirected because of misinformation.  With this in mind, I would like to ask some questions on some suppositions we've been acting upon.

First, where did we discover that "-ana" denotes action?   I simply wish confirmation, as it appears to fit elegantly into the scripts we have.

Second, we surmised that "ma-", even though meaning "one", might denote a proper term.   In other words, if something says "one-mask one-black", it denotes "the black mask", as was translated from one of the plaques.  Someone mentioned that this was confirmed as being true.  Is this so?   

Also, please be mindful that there are some major variants in how this script expresses complex ideas, versus the way we do it.  There appears to be no tense in the writings, meaning that there is no way to denote a term as referring to past, present or future.  If there is a way to denote date, or passage of time, we have yet to discover it.   It is as if reading this script necessitates you to put yourself in the present of what you are reading.  In other words, rather than say "I went to the barn and brought the hay", I would say "I go to the barn, I carry the hay to here."  It's quite fascinating.

Also, I surmised that their use of numbers indicates a lack of abstract thinking with regard to mathematics.  As with the old joke:  "One-two-three-many", it appears that, in several places, the number "nine" appears without context.  This may be used to indicate "many", but we do not know.  This leads me to believe that the language is ideographic, rather than lexical.  In other words, the language denotes ideas, concepts and beliefs, rather than to present specifics and details.   As we surmise that the word, and by association the song, are what created all things, then three vs. four is a lot less important than to identify life, death, dreams, hope and fire.   

I present these last two concept to serve as food for though.  While consistent within the script, they are not proven as of yet, so I do not present them for serious consideration. 

Stay warm,
Shoshann
Title: Re: Ritual Words
Post by: Shoshann on March 20, 2017, 10:48:55 am
Greetings,

I wanted to share with you of the success of a ritual that we performed during our recent arrival at the shelter cavern.  As you may have noticed, any time the cavern mouth was opened, a biting cold would enter our hovel and chill us to the bone.  As this would not lead to us being able to rest, I called upon Mishkin and Illyana to collaborate in a ritual, designed to keep us warm during our stay.

We constructed our ritual around the story of the brazier that I keep fueled, a gift from the temple of Dhegea.  Calling upon the fire, I supplicated Dhegea for her favor, that our home would be sheltered from the cold and we be kept warm.  We compounded the words:

DHIGE'A (Volcano) - ("I beseech Deghea to provide us warmth...")
SHEPAKEL (Shield) - ("To shield us from the freezing cold...")
BEN DANSUBA (Home) - ("That our home remain safe and secure...")

As with these matters, we are unsure of the outcome, but we definitely felt that something happened and that the room was awash in energy.  I observed that, from that point forward, no freezing cold entered through the door when new people arrived. 

This was a test of our understanding of the language of old.  It appears to have been successful, but time and further trials will tell us more.  One thing that we discovered was that by dedicating our attention and placing more of our Focus on the ritual, we may yield better results. 

Stay warm,
Shoshann
Title: Re: Ritual Words
Post by: Layla on March 20, 2017, 11:20:20 am
The nice cook lady (and cook man) came in with a game, cards that we realized had ritual words and pictures on them. We drew folks' attention to it and Viola, Niko, and myself played the game for the prize of a brownie.

While playing the nice lady gave us hints about the words and their meanings. We clarified while Viola and Niko were taking turns about some of the concepts since she seemed quite familiar with them (we thought it was odd for a cook to know such things but perhaps it is because she makes magical brownies?) So we asked about Ma and whether it could be used as "a" or "an" since it denotes one and she agreed. While talking about the word for flower Nihzel, she indicated with gestures that nihzel was a thing, stationary. With nihzelana she made a movement with the gesture she used for nihzel, as if it was blooming or flowering. Lum said we should clarify by asking if a couple other words would make sense with ana added to them, one of which would make sense and one that wouldn't. She confirmed that it was essentially used to denote action which could be contrued as a verb. Lum thought that -ing was particularly appropriate and I agreed.

We DID think it was particularly odd that the nice cook lady and man could not (cannot?) seem to outright discuss these things and need to use gestures and images to help get the ideas across to aid us.

Also the brownie Viola let me eat was...interesting.

It sent me into a vision, a Weavewalk I believe. I saw an all consuming light and it was terrible and wonderful. There was  man and a woman who experienced it too. We heard voice(s), they called out and wanted us to tell them THE WORD. that we couldn't hide it from them. There was screaming and the weave shattered. I think the word they wanted was a specific ritual word but that is only conjecture.

Layla

 



Title: Re: Ritual Words
Post by: Marcel de Giverny on March 20, 2017, 11:47:18 am
According to a conversation with Shoshone, he says the apostrophe in "DHIGE'A" should be pronounced with an "f" sound, making the proper pronunciation of that word "Thigefa" when one considers the "Dh" at the beginning.

Again, I know not where he came across the "f", but he seemed confident.

Shoshann, can you elaborate on your confidence of the apostrophe pronunciation?  I'm making a primer and making footnotes of sources, along with the source's confidence.
Title: Re: Ritual Words
Post by: Shoshann on March 20, 2017, 09:36:05 pm
The pronounciation of apostrophe as "f" was taught to me by the person that Layla refers to as "the nice cook lady", the same person who introduced us to the card game that provided us with so many words.  She commented to me that the pronounciation for Dhige'a was "Thigefa".  I asked for confirmation, which she provided.

Shoshann
Title: Re: Ritual Words
Post by: Marcel de Giverny on March 21, 2017, 06:53:33 am
Excellent, thank you!
Title: Re: Ritual Words
Post by: Chel Verdansk on March 21, 2017, 08:31:34 pm
I have question.  One of words we have is "Dothu = Favored of Dothu/someone wit vow."  Who is "Dothu"?  I don't remember hearing about dis deity before.
Title: Re: Ritual Words
Post by: Marcel de Giverny on March 22, 2017, 07:49:46 am
I have question.  One of words we have is "Dothu = Favored of Dothu/someone wit vow."  Who is "Dothu"?  I don't remember hearing about dis deity before.

I've been compiling a dictionary with footnotes.  Here are the attributions I don't have:

Ashen - Dream/good dream (speculative)
Dothu - A favored of Dothu / someone wiht a vow
Kazhagen - Moon
Mosho - New/Newness (speculative)
Nakezil - orange
Nazinzhan - phoenix/transformation
Penezil - squirrel
Penthemega - a Weavewalker
Sepezel - Rabbit
She'ashen'ata - Lady of Dreams (speculative)
Sopumosho - someone new to the area
Toshon - owl

So some are marked as speculative, but I'm inclined to mark them all as speculative until I can get a source for them.  I'm guessing many are someone's ritual words, so if I could get an attribution, that would be very helpful.
Title: Re: Ritual Words
Post by: Miri Thorel on March 22, 2017, 07:58:02 am
The three marked speculative are my speculations. ASHEN and MOSHO are just based on other words. SHE'ASHEN'ATA is based on its use in the chants and things like that.

I think DOTHU and SOPUMOSHO came from the ritual to set up the Treasury shrine - maybe Mercutio or Thaddeus would know for sure. PENTHEMEGA might be from that too, or might be from the Troyvich window and ritual that got done back at the waystation. I think NAZINZHAN is from the window ritual but I'm not sure.

The others are all the kind of thing that could have come from someone's Pathfolding or Weavewalking rituals. We also saw KAZHAGEN in conjunction with a moon symbol on some of the plaques.

--Miri

Title: Re: Ritual Words
Post by: Miri Thorel on March 22, 2017, 08:00:03 am
Greetings,

I wanted to share with you of the success of a ritual that we performed during our recent arrival at the shelter cavern.  As you may have noticed, any time the cavern mouth was opened, a biting cold would enter our hovel and chill us to the bone.  As this would not lead to us being able to rest, I called upon Mishkin and Illyana to collaborate in a ritual, designed to keep us warm during our stay.

We constructed our ritual around the story of the brazier that I keep fueled, a gift from the temple of Dhegea.  Calling upon the fire, I supplicated Dhegea for her favor, that our home would be sheltered from the cold and we be kept warm.  We compounded the words:

DHIGE'A (Volcano) - ("I beseech Deghea to provide us warmth...")
SHEPAKEL (Shield) - ("To shield us from the freezing cold...")
BEN DANSUBA (Home) - ("That our home remain safe and secure...")

As with these matters, we are unsure of the outcome, but we definitely felt that something happened and that the room was awash in energy.  I observed that, from that point forward, no freezing cold entered through the door when new people arrived. 

This was a test of our understanding of the language of old.  It appears to have been successful, but time and further trials will tell us more.  One thing that we discovered was that by dedicating our attention and placing more of our Focus on the ritual, we may yield better results. 

Stay warm,
Shoshann

Um... this doesn't have anything to do with the fissure and magma and hot gases that people are saying have shown up at the back end of the Expedition, does it?

--Miri
Title: Re: Ritual Words
Post by: Ilyani on March 22, 2017, 08:01:20 am
 I can confirm Toshon is Owl.
Title: Re: Ritual Words
Post by: Marcel de Giverny on March 22, 2017, 08:30:48 am
I can confirm Toshon is Owl.

Thanks.

Oh, I don't need a source if things are marked as speculation.  Or rather, I don't want to slow down speculation by trying to attach sources to them.  :)
Title: Re: Ritual Words
Post by: Hazel on March 22, 2017, 10:33:16 pm
Can confirm that KAZHANGEN means moon (Pathfinding word).
Title: Re: Ritual Words
Post by: Chel Verdansk on March 23, 2017, 04:48:04 pm
So, here is a hypotesis:

We have a word "Zhadogodun," for which we only know "zhado=stone".  What does rest of word mean?

Fact: We also know a word "Kotodun," people who live in de Silver Daggers, near Mt. Koto.  Is tis useful to us?  Is "katodun" Ancient word?  Well, we know dat "koto" is Ancient (Plaque 13: 1st word)1, altough we do not know meaning. 

Surmise: "Kotodun= People of2 Koto", with "dun = People of"

tus, furder surmise:  "Zhadogodun = People of Stone go"

For wild speculation, could "Zhadogodun" mean dese Stone Cults I hearing about lately?

---
1 - I use numbers written on Plaque, instead of what we surmise is order

2 - "of" could also mean "near," "in te proximity of," "can see," "is effected by," etc.
Title: Re: Ritual Words
Post by: Branka on March 28, 2017, 04:18:32 pm
I didn't see this one in the ritual book so either I missed it or never shared it.

gadezil = horse

it's one of my ritual words.
Title: Re: Ritual Words
Post by: Marcel de Giverny on March 29, 2017, 11:34:50 am
It's there, but I've added the extra attribution (because multiple primary sources is a good thing).
Title: Re: Ritual Words
Post by: Misia on March 31, 2017, 08:38:01 pm

Surmise: "Kotodun= People of2 Koto", with "dun = People of"

tus, furder surmise:  "Zhadogodun = People of Stone go"

For wild speculation, could "Zhadogodun" mean dese Stone Cults I hearing about lately?

---
1 - I use numbers written on Plaque, instead of what we surmise is order

2 - "of" could also mean "near," "in te proximity of," "can see," "is effected by," etc.

I had an intuition that -dun meant people. Though I had no evidence for it.
Title: Re: Ritual Words
Post by: Chel Verdansk on April 02, 2017, 06:50:23 pm

I had an intuition that -dun meant people. Though I had no evidence for it.

Still no real evidence.  Not quite wild speculation, but not firm eiter.